Interview with Roger Wilkins, President of the Financial Action Task Force (FATF):”We need to focus on concrete things that we can achieve together”
In a closed meeting of the Counter-Terrorism Committee (CTC) held on 18 December 2014, the President of the Financial Action Task Force () Mr. Roger Wilkins briefed the Committee on FATF activities and cooperation between the United Nations and the FATF. Following the briefing, the Counter-Terrorism Committee Executive Directorate (CTED) sat down with Mr. Wilkins for an exclusive interview.
What is FATF’s general assessment of the threat posed by terrorist financing globally?
This is obviously a very complex question. One of the major changes is that the concept of state-sponsored terrorism is no longer a major issue in the modern world of terrorism. What you are looking at now is actors operating in the same way as multinational corporations which are part of the global economy, generating funds through a number of different activities, including profit-making mechanisms. Usually they receive some funding through donations, but donations are not a sustainable source of funding as they tend to be a one-off. Instead, these actors use resources such as oil, diamonds, drugs… So we are looking at enterprises that trade in goods and produce, maybe even human trafficking to some extent – and moving funds. In the case of ISIL, they are not only running a de facto corporation, but also an army. Whereas the taking down of Al-Qaeda after 9/11 was largely successful, we now have the proliferation of Al-Qaeda branches nationally around the world, and we see the proliferation of funds as well. Another observation is that today terrorism is quite cheap, and that terrorism is linked to organized crime in imaginative and opportunistic ways.
How can the FATF contribute to the implementation of Security Council resolution 2178 (2014) with regards to the prevention of the financing of foreign terrorist fighters and ISIL?
First of all, we have listed six steps that countries have to follow under the existing resolutions to comply with standards and requirements of Security Council resolution 2178 (2014) – and we will hold them accountable to that through the normal processes. The second main thing is the project team that I referred to in my briefing to the Counter-Terrorism Committee, which we are hoping will come up with more intelligence, a better understanding of what money there is, where it is coming from, and spurring others to act on these findings. It is very clear to us that Security Council resolution 2178 falls within the purview of the FATF standards, as it is a terrorism financing-related resolution, so this is obviously something that will form part of our mutual evaluation process as we go through countries assessing their implementation.
What is the FATF doing to create greater awareness with the private sector about the risks of foreign terrorist fighters?
We do a lot of work in terms of guidance for the private sector on a whole range of issues, including in this area, that are distributed to key players in different countries. We also organise regular discussions with the private sector, and every year we have a proper consultation with the key players – banks, insurance companies, and regulatory bodies – at various levels. We also do a lot of engagement with the private sector as an important routine part of our country assessments. I think importantly now is that some regulators are raising the spectre of non-compliance with us, which is concentrating the minds of a number of private sector players to raise the level of awareness in a way I think they haven’t before. In some cases, for example, where banks have failed to comply with some of these regulations, large amounts of money have been paid in fines – and the publicity around these cases has done a lot in terms of raising private sector awareness. What is positive is that there is an appetite out there to find out more from us about these standards, and what these private actors need to do to comply with them.
How can the United Nations contribute to the work of FATF?
There are a number of practical things we can do together: First of all, the United Nations can assist in making our reports public, which helps in terms of making Member States and jurisdictions comply with our recommendations. Secondly, we want to make sure that the UN’s and the FATF’s country assessments are in line. In today’s briefing, which was very useful, we talked about the parameters of the problem; next we need to talk about systems, incentives, opportunities, and solutions, in a broader follow-up conversation.
The past mutual evaluations have shown that Member States experience challenges in implementing the freezing of terrorist assets. What could be done to improve the compliance of Member States with their obligations and to emphasize on the benefits of these preventive measures?
I think there needs to be a lot more continued outreach in this area, as well as making technical assistance available. This is a universal problem. I think there are several countries that don’t understand what they need to do to mitigate their terrorism financing risks – which is different from their terrorism risk. Everybody needs to do their part; otherwise money will continue to flow through the weakest link.
In some Member States there might be a lack of political will, in others a lack of capacity, and in a third group of countries a misunderstanding of what can or cannot be achieved by the legal system. We need to get away from what can at times be abstract discussions and focus on operational, concrete things that we can achieve together.